Interviews
The
Will Lee Interview
Will
Lee's Funk House]January 10th, 2002
ABOUT
WILL LEE
"As
one of the New York City’s most sought-after session players,
bassist Will Lee has a resume that reads like a who’s who of
the music industry. He’s toured with artists including B.J. Thomas,
Horace Silver, Bette Midler, Barry Manilow, The Brecker Brothers,
and Herbie Mann, while his tight, “in the pocket” playing
can be heard on records by David Sanborn, Boz Scaggs, Carly Simon,
Frank Sinatra, Steely Dan, Cat Stevens, and Barbara Streisand, to
name just a few.
But
most people will probably recognize Lee for his nightly appearances
on the CBS Late Show with David Letterman, where he’s played
bass with the CBS Orchestra and bandleader Paul Shaffer for years,
delving into just about every style of music on the planet..."
[...more]
-
from "America's Favorite Bassist Talks Tone" - by Lachlan
Westfall and Pablo LaRosa for the Roland US website.
MV:
As the foremost studio bass player in New York, can you comment on
the current state of studio work and how it's changed over the years,
for example in jingles and in record dates?
Will
Lee:
Well, the "current state" just got better with that compliment,
the foremost studio bass player - I feel like everything's
fine now!
Of
course, you know, when you talk about studio work, there used to be
a "studio scene" in New York. I mean, there was a such a
scene of guys getting together in the studio, that that
was everybody's social life…. And that also gave rise to an outside-the-studio
social scene. It created a need for "hangs" here and there.
There
was a place called "Jim & Andy's"… it was a place
where people convened - this was kind of before I came to town…
it was a very established thing that people would go there and drink
in between sessions and gigs to socialize. They even had a direct
line to the answering service, Radio Registry.
People
would call The Registry from there; The Registry would call people
that were in there. And, although I never actually saw that place
I know that it was a not only a social scene where guys would schmooze
and give and get gigs from each other, but it was also a place where
guys would meet to go somewhere to go to a gig, like where the bus
would meet guys, like for a big band gig or some stuff like that...
And
there was a Chinese restaurant called "China Song."
And there was also a place that was created by an accountant called
"Possible Twenty" - twenty musicians who'd agreed to invest
in this place were its owners. And "Possible Twenty" - what
it means is that the sessions were booked - especially jingles - were
booked for an hour with "a possible twenty"… so you'd
get a call to come do a Colgate commercial, 10 o'clock to 11 o'clock
with a "possible twenty" - in the morning.
MV:
Is that place still around?
Will:
No, that was closed down by some sleaze ball activity that was happening
there… not to do with the musicians, but to do with somebody
who was in charge of the whole thing. I think the accountant that
started the whole deal…
So,
the studio scene has changed - there's no scene anymore!
You
know, there used to be ten, possibly twelve, maybe even 15 major studios
where all the stuff was being done. Jingles, records, some film. Since
then, and as we know, everybody's second bedroom can be a studio.
There are maybe 3000 of those "little scenes" around town,
so there's not any real meeting place - there's not any real kind
of "scene". So to me that's the biggest factor in how studio
work has changed.
It's
gotten totally compartmentalized. And of course, everybody's the producer
now… everybody's a drummer; everybody's a bass player….
And everybody tries to do everything by himself in front of his computer.
The guy in front of the computer doesn't need people. He doesn't need
to hang out anymore.
I think that records are different for me, for the kinds of records
that I do, but a lot of guys want to save bread, a lot of advertising
agencies want to save bread and they just try to get a guy who will
do everything with samples and stuff. You know, unless you want something
"super special" - that's where you would hire a lot of "real
musicians" - where you'd want something really, really rich and
super-special…
As
I heard years ago from Ralph McDonald actually, (who I quote all the
time) - he said, "If you're great, you're gonna work"…
the best people are going to work.
I
would hate to be a guy with my limited talent starting out right now.
I honestly think that a main reason that I have a name at all in the
business is because I started out at a time when there weren't that
many people doing what I do…
MV: Being a quintessential NY musician, do you think there
is a different energy in the NY musical community versus elsewhere
in America? If so, how has this difference informed your playing?
Will:
Well, that's an easy one, because when I first came to New York, one
of the first things I noticed was that when you got within miles of
the city limits of this burg called New York, you could feel the energy
to the point where it's like stepping on to a ride that's already
moving. Like a Ferris wheel… or more like a merry-go-round…
You just jump on and you're moving with it! It definitely kicked my
ass!
I
came from a much more musically sleepy town and a much more "energy
sleepy" town. I came from Texas and Miami and those places didn't
have near the vibrancy that this town has. So, your music has got
to be affected by that…
MV: Did being around so many accomplished musicians in NYC
raise the level of your own playing?
Will: Oh absolutely… I mean, I'm in a place now that I
never dreamed of being… when I first came to New York, I came
because I was invited by a band called Dreams to do an audition. Luckily
I passed the audition, but once I was here - and after the band broke
up - then what was I going to do?? I was only considering one possibility
and that was heading right back down to Miami where I came from. Cause
I'd have gotten down there and I'd be "king shit" and "Mr
New York!!"
Instead
of running away, some people talked me into staying. And when I was
stuck in that position, I was seeing this whole studio scene, and
never dreaming that I'd ever be a part of it. It looked like I was
looking out at this impenetrable bubble; this really sewn-up situation.
And guys probably had spent years getting into that scene, and I was
gonna have nothing to do with that, because it was such an elite-looking
scene (for an outsider, anyway).
And
so I stayed, and it was an ideal, great thing to be doing! To be in
a different band a couple of different times a day, and playing fresh,
new music that you'd never even have to think about again, then moving
on to the next one…You know… "NEXT!" And being
allowed to insert your creativity to a certain extent in every one
of those situations… that can really wake up that muscle of creativity
over and over again… it was pretty cool for a lazy guy like me!
Or an undisciplined guy like me, I should say...
Mike: I can't imagine that with all of your work you could
possibly be lazy or undisciplined!
Will: Well, it's true! I'm not lazy when it comes to accepting
work, but I'm lazy when it comes to maybe creating work. That's my
nature, I've been fighting with that since forever. I try to stay
on top of that.
Mike: Do you find yourself in recording situations where you're
overdubbing bass parts to pre-existing drums or sequenced rhythms
and do you miss the live interaction that was the general rule in
the "golden age" of the NY studio scene?
Will: I think that of course "the hang" is one of
the great reasons to be doing music as far as I'm concerned. I'm not
a person who has adapted to sitting in front of a computer by himself…
and I don't get the greatest charge out of that. But, I do love bouncing
off of someone creatively. Maybe not "bouncing" so much,
but leaning on somebody else to be great technically, and to get a
lot of those other things done.
I do miss "the hang"…. I do miss that interaction.
I mean, it's doable… of course you can add a bass part to a drum
machine and make it come alive. Or you can get a replacement and let
somebody else just do it with a machine. I just prefer doing it rather
than having it be done by someone else who's not a bass player.
Mike: You have a long-standing relationship with Sadowsky
basses. What is your current neck/body/pickup configuration?
Will: Well, Sadowsky has always been great for me. He's been
great at not only listening to my needs, but listening to me explaining
my needs very badly, and actually translating them into something
musical.
What I've ended up with is kind of a jazz bass configuration as far
as pickups on a Fender-y type body. And lately, even though I started
out loving rosewood necks I'm kind of a maple neck guy at the moment.
As soon as I find a bass where the relationship between the pickups
and a rosewood neck is back to where it was when my favorite bass
that I ever owned burned up in a fire, I will probably be back as
"Mr Rosewood" again. I will be "Mr. Rosewood."
Mike: Which bass did you lose?
Will: I lost it many years ago in a fire… it was a Precision
bass that I'd used on a lot of great records and stuff….hopefully
I can stumble on to one of those P-basses again that has that same
kind of magic that one had. I mean, even the best P-bass I don't think
would satisfy me the way a jazz bass could, as far as being versatile.
I do think Leo kind of got it right the first time though!
But I do love active electronics, for that extra "snap"…
Will's Pedal Board
image from the Will
Lee Website
Mike:
You've played and recorded with some of the most legendary artists
in music. Do you have a favorite artist or recording session that
you feel has brought out your most inspired performance?
Will:
Well, it has nothing to do with the artist. I think it has more to
do with 
the
material the artist chooses to perform. That's what dictates the way
I feel about what I'm playing on that track. In other words, it's
sort of like the situation I need to be in to be inspired is a great
groove, a great feel…a great song with some cool chord changes.
Those are the things that make me inspired. What are some of those
situations? I guess maybe Chaka Khan's first album, her first solo
album.
And
what else? There have been some times in the studio with Donald Fagen
that were really, really fun. Like on "The Nightfly" session
and another we did with him. Actually I did some of the sessions for
"Gaucho" but I didn't end up on the record because I think
they thought of the drummer and me as a team. They didn't let me try
playing with another drummer on any of the songs. But, I really enjoyed
it just because of the quality of the songwriting. And anytime there's
like a really great groove, where everybody's totally in sync - you
know, where you're not fighting the drummer. It's hard to put this
into words - but when you're feeling it, it's as Don Grolnick said,
"if you feel it, it's the right thing."
Mike: Any other examples where you listen now and say, "Yeah,
that was a great session?"
Will: For example, there's a record of James Brown's "Get
Up Offa That 
Thing"
- and it was one of those things where we were doing a batch of tunes…
I don't think even half of 'em had titles. You know, like "Groove
Number 19" for instance, and then James Brown would come in afterwards
and would put his vocal on it. If I had known that it was gonna be
that song and he had been in his booth singing that shit at the same
time, that would have been one of my favorite sessions. But as it
was, it was just like, okay, we're vamping along… I'm playing
"doo doo doo doo doo doo - a doo doo doo doo doo" and the
drummer is playing a disco feel…. "Okay…. that's fun…
NEXT!" So it wasn't as memorable as it might have been. But,
it's memorable now because everybody has heard that song, and it's
like a song… but it was really just a vamp.
Mike: Besides being "America's Favorite Bassist"
and the most visible bass player, you are also an accomplished singer,
composer and leader in your own right. What projects are you currently
working on where we can hear these talents apart from your bass playing?
Will: There you go again with the accolades! Lets see…
what's happening right now?
I
just got through arranging background vocals for a Linda
Eder CD, coming out on Atlantic. She's a really fine singer. I'm
singing a lot of backgrounds on her record.
And
another guy from Texas named "Homer" - I don't even know
if he's gonna use a last name because I was never introduced to him
with a last name, just "Homer" - and I got to arrange some
background parts and sing a bunch of backgrounds on his project…
lets see what else is happening….
Mike: The
Fab Faux??
Will: Yes - The
Fab Faux! - I'm doing plenty of singing in that band! That's like
five guys who really sing well together. That's my Beatle band…
and actually, we're about to go to Arizona and do a gig in Scottsdale.
And we just got through performing The White Album here in New York
for two nights and that was really amazing.
Will with The Fab Faux [image from TheFabFaux.com]
Mike: Do you do more than play the bass for "The Faux"?
Aren't you the leader of this band?
Will: Well, kind of. I mean, I don't get any more money than
anybody else, and I formed the thing…kind of with the drummer
Rich Pagano. And in the case of "Revolution Number Nine"
I was not playing bass, I was reading my script… just doing my
little part.
BirdHouse - Will's Upcoming CD [click for larger image]
Mike:
Can you tell us a bit about your upcoming Charlie Parker CD?
Will: BirdHouse is really a fun thing! It's an idea my dad
had. My dad is in his seventies - he's a great jazz piano player in
the school of Bud Powell. And he's been playing his whole life. He's
also a music educator.
Mike: His name is Bill Lee?
Will: Yes, Bill Lee - William F. Lee III… [see image,
right, from BirdHouse, Will with his dad]...
He
said, "let's get some cats together and do an album of Charlie
Parker tunes!' And it ended up being really spectacular. It was kind
of thought of originally as, "alright dad, lets you and I do
something together - and give a tape to the family members."
But it ended up being so fantastic with the talents of Billy Hart
on drums and Bob Dorough singing in his inimitable style. And Mike
Brecker playing tenor and Randy Brecker and Lew Soloff playing trumpets.
John Tropea playing guitar and Warren Chiasson playing vibes…
It's something we're both really proud of. I'm especially proud of
it…. Because it's just a good jazz album in the
very traditional sense…very kind of be-bop…
Mike: When's it coming out?
Will: It's going to be released here in the states, in a limited
way… within a few days, actually!
So,
yeah, I had a great time mixing it and a great time editing it and
sequencing it… (putting it in the order its in) It starts out
with a bang with Mike Brecker playing "Confirmation." Other
songs from the project are "Lover Man", "Donna Lee",
"Anthropology", "Ornithology", "Yardbird
Suite" (as sung by Bob Dorough), and "Quasimodo". It's
just really a great, great time!
Mike:
Do you have advice you could give to aspiring professional musicians
who might be trying to break into the NY music scene? Or, given your
answer to the first couple of questions, is there even a scene left?
Will: Well, there's definitely still a scene! This week I'm
playing on at least like four albums. So, there is some kind of scene
happening.
I
can only talk from the experience that I have had of getting into
this so-called "scene" and it was half luck and half lust.
First of all, if you want to be in a scene, you have to be in a town
that has some kind of a scene. I mean, I don't think people with the
talent that I have would be of much use in a "farm scene"
for example!! They'd probably be completely useless and probably be
asked to leave…they'd just be in the way…
Mike: "Get out of here, you're disturbing the cows!"…
Will: Exactly! And the cows are trying to sleep… and the
pigs are getting ornery…
But yeah, such a big part of it is proximity to where you're needed.
And a lot of it is who you know - we all know that.
I used to have jam sessions at my apartment and have guys come over
and we'd just play - for no reason - I mean, that was the reason -
to play. There wasn't going to be any money in it, it wasn't going
to cost any of us anything except a few pennies of my power bill to
plug-in. And through that kind of networking you would get to know
guys and how they played.
They would hear you, you would watch them grow, they would see you
come along - it was very kind of organic… how my sort of scene
grew, one little thing at a time.
I remember one time, I was in the studio with Steve Gadd, who was
the drummer of the band Dreams that I was in New York to be in, and
it was toward the end of the bands run. And I'd done like zero jingles
in my entire life. And he called me up because he'd been doing sessions
with Tony Levin for a company and the company was in the middle of
doing a big ad campaign for Contac cold pills. And Tony couldn't make
this one day's worth of recording these spots for Contac. They were
doing all kinds of versions - rock versions, country versions and
blues versions and stuff - for radio and TV. And Steve recommended
me to replace Tony on this one session!
So,
I walked in and played - and it was great! They were all real happy
with what happened. (Cause if you're playing with a guy like Steve
Gadd, you're gonna sound great anyway!)
So, after the session, because I was in this band Dreams that they
considered to be like a real super hip, elite thing, you know, "this
guy's at the top of the scene he knows what's happening" kind
of thing - (little did they know that I didn't know anything) - they
asked me if I came across anybody in my travels who had like a real
white blues kind of vocal sound. As I was packing up my bass…about
to leave the studio, I sang out, "Heeeeeeeeyyyyyyy!!!!"
And they're like, "YES! That's it! Come in tomorrow and sing
this Contac Cold Pill final commercial!" And I show up the next
day and did the thing for radio and it went right to the air, and
it was like POW! I don't know what that is other than luck.
So, that was just one of the many little things that sort of got me
started. I mean after that, that wasn't the last gig I did for those
guys. Now they know me, so now I'm getting called by these guys. And
other people, fresh new faces, are coming into the studio with the
same old me, and maybe Gadd, maybe another drummer, and now I'm starting
to know these other new guys. And things were starting to spread.
And as soon as I'd get into another studio situation with a different
producer at another company, even more of the same started to happen…
"Oh he plays and sings too", you know…
My introduction to another jingle company happened when I was hired
to sing and play on a Kentucky Fried Chicken spot, way back in the
early 70s. From that moment on I worked for that producer for like
twenty something years after that day!! So, it's just like stepping
into a scene and making the right impression and then who knows what
can happen…?
Mike: So, what advice can we distill from those experiences
for someone just starting out, or hoping to become a professional?
Will: Well, the advice is to do your best and try to be cool
in the different situations. Try to be musical and appropriate for
what's needed. If you're looking to be a studio person, be able to
do more than just one little thing… have your reading chops happening…
try to be versatile in your style…
Mike:
Are there any mistakes you see aspiring professional musicians make?
Any "must avoid" suggestions?
Will: I would humbly suggest that aspiring musicians try not
to be too overconfident or cocky. Whether it's helped my career or
not, I don't know, but it's helped my sanity to assume that this gig
that I'm on at this moment…is gonna be the last gig. If I don't
have something already booked, I have no reason to assume this is
not my last gig. So, I treat every gig like it was my last gig…
and I think that might have helped in some way
And as much as I'm into "the hang" I'm also serious about
the music… I mean, I've been doing this since 1971, and it really
hasn't slowed down… so, I think it's helped my longevity…
and I've seen at least three generations of guys come and go and never
be heard from again. Treat every gig like it was your last, and take
the music seriously…
Your
Questions For Will...
From
Todd In Tennessee: In dealing with drummers throughout the years,
I've found (as I'm sure you have) how vastly different two drummers
can play the same basic rhythm, even good ol' straight 4.
Do
ya find: 1) there are some players who are just 180º from your
innate way of feeling time... 2) what do ya do about it?...3) (and
this is probably a very subjective question) I've talked to drummers
who believe being "in the pocket" means laying back on 1
and 3, and some who think it's 2 and 4. I'm a 2 and 4 guy, and I sometimes
struggle with the 1 and 3 crowd. What do YOU feel, and how does a
2/4 guy keep his sanity in a 1/3 world???
Will:
Of course there are people that feel time differently than you do!
That's kind of a wonderful thing when you think about it. You know,
otherwise you have your computer that you can only set through "Swing
Level A" to "Swing Level E"! So, yes, there are plenty
of people who feel the time differently than you do and that keeps
things interesting, of course.
But, what do you do about it? What do you want to do about it? Do
you want to fight? …
Let's
simplify the question and say we're talking about drummers because
that's what I can answer better - what do I do about it? Well, unless
the guy's groove is just awful I try to go with the guy… cause
I think it's probably not gonna sound as good if you take the other
approach, and have the guy who has a louder instrument - and he's
bashing on it with two hands and both legs, to try to come over to
your groove. So, if he's got a groove, I would say go just go with
it. And how do you go about doing that? Well, you have to loosen up
and you have to feel it for what it is. And even if it's not the way
you would have approached the song, well, what are you going to do?
You're going to end up struggling and fighting and it's not going
to really be the greatest for the listener.
I've been in the situation where the guy just has a really lousy time
feel. That's happened to me way plenty, especially in the early days,
as I came from a place where there were very few good drummers around.
The competition wasn't nearly what it is now, and there were just
a lot of bad drummers around. And so I got used to being the guy who
was pretty much the timekeeper. And I stuck to where I knew the time
should be. And the drummers, being that they didn't have very much
confidence in playing time, well, at least that meant that they weren't
too bull-headed about what they were doing.
So, it ended up being a lot of extra work for me but at least I was
able to provide a groove for the whole band.
And this is a different situation than a guy who has good time but
a lousy feel. I'm talking about a guy with NO time. So, it's doable.
It's a drag, but it's doable.
I don't run into many guys like that these days, the competition's
way too strong for that. Guys have learned to play. These days we're
exposed to a lot more music than we ever have been before. There didn't
used to be twenty-four hour music channels on TV, where you can just
watch people play all day long - and get a lesson every time you turn
the TV on.
But, it's funny cause, well, here's a little story that's happened
to me more than a thousand times. It's like, you'd be in a studio,
you'd be playing with a guy who had lousy time…. you'd work your
ass off, I mean to the point where your muscles hurt cause you were
sweating so hard to make it groove. You'd go in the studio, and people
would be so happy with how groovin' it was, and you really couldn't
tell that the drummer just sucked. And it was because of all the work
that you, the bass player, had done.
And in a way, you'd almost get fooled yourself, if you hadn't known
just how much work had gone into making that thing sound like it was
grooving.
On
to the fourth part of this question, " I'm a 2 and 4 guy, and
I sometimes struggle with the 1 and 3 crowd. What do YOU feel, and
how does a 2/4 guy keep his sanity in a 1/3 world??? "
My answer to that question is that the "1 and 3 world" -
these are MY people… these are white people… So, what do
you do? You just have to groove as much as you get. That's how you
keep your sanity. These are white people, they're always gonna be
around, just relax…
From
Jason Weaver: Will, I know that one thing we have in common is
an minor-obsession and extreme respect for Paul McCartney and his
accomplishments as a bassist, composer and person. How amazing was
it to work with him for the Concert for NY? Also, was that Abe Laboriel,
Jr. playing drums? How much preparation did you have for the performance?
Thank you in advance for your reply and inspiration.
Will:
Of course, playing with Paul McCartney was unbelievably, frighteningly
great. It's almost like I couldn't look him in the eyes… it was
so frighteningly great!
Had it not been for him being such a perfect gentleman, and a guy
who just knows how to work the room in general, I probably would have
been just a wreck. But he made it really comfortable. He's so adept
at human relationship stuff - we used to see how the Beatles would
work the crowd when they were doing press conferences, they always
knew what to say... it was amazing… It was a situation I will
never forget, (but greedily), hope I will find myself in again!
Mike: Was he aware of your band, The
Fab Faux?
Will: I actually told him about that. I had to get up the nerve
to tell him about it, cause I knew that he had a history of not liking
"Beatle bands"…So I told him about our band, I tried
to convince him that it wasn't a "wig band" … it wasn't
a "wig quartet"… it wasn't a band that put on fake
English accents when they talked in between songs… That it was
a band that out of huge respect, tries to do the later sort of harder
stuff, the more difficult, impossible to do stuff. So, what did he
say? He challenged me when I told him that and he said, "Really???
Well… do you do "Tomorrow Never Knows?" And I said,
"of course!!" So that was kind of fun to be able to say
that…
Abe Laboriel, Jr. was indeed playing drums with Paul McCartney. He
did the last album, so Paul used the rhythm section from the album
except for when he was playing piano and couldn't play bass at the
same time, That was when I got to slide in…
How
much preparation did I do for the performance? I did very little,
and it was my own fault, because … well, the hardest tune was
a new song , "From A Lover To A Friend"… from the current
album. That was one I knew that was gonna be tough because it had
strange length bars in it.
So,
Paul and some other musicians were in one rehearsal room and I was
in the next… sitting there alone, playing along with a cassette
I was given by his producer, David Kahn.
And me, being totally impatient, and not wanting to miss one second
of this - I went in prematurely, totally before I was ready, and said,
"look guys, if you don't mind, I hear you guys are rehearsing
this song right now, I can hear it through the door, can I just struggle
through it with you? So they were cool and said "sure!"
And I got to prolong my time with Paul McCartney… by SUCKING!!!
By walking in half-prepared instead of totally prepared. Cause I could
have gone thorough it just one time, and walked out of the room, but
I didn't want that to happen… as it was we not only were doing
that songs, but others. Yeah, it was great…
From Scott: "Will, I've been wondering about this for
years...Is that you in the Paula Abdul video "Cold Hearted Snake,"
or just someone that looks like you?
Will:
I've been asked that question a million times before, and the answer
is "I don't know!" Is it me? Or is it the guy from "Dumb
and Dumber" - what's his name, Jeff Daniels? I don't know…
maybe it's both of us… I honestly don't know. But whoever it
is, I thank that person for keeping my image alive and keeping people
thinking of me. On behalf of Jeff Daniels, and myself, I'd like to
thank that person for keeping both our images alive.
A
HUGE THANKS TO WILL FOR DOING THIS INTERVIEW!!
FOR
MORE INFORMATION ON WILL LEE
For
more information on Will, please visit the following websites:
The
Official Will Lee Website (Will Lee's Funk House) - http://www.willlee.com
The
Fab Faux - the greatest Beatles tribute band EVER - http://www.thefabfaux.com
Did
you know that Will is a PADI Certified Dive Master? Will supports
The
Cousteau Society - your contributions would be greatly appreciated!
